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[Primogen]

I am trying to help my brother sell his provisional patent or "idea" to the right development company.  Product is technology based and will need much development and research.  Once designed and implemented, it will have a world-wide market and is something NOT currently in use in the field it is designed for.

We are almost completely lost on the appropriate next step.  We have:   Provisional Patent,  Working name and logo, rudimentary schematics, a single elegant render, descriptive scenario explaining the concept, conceptual images of product in use, as well as: detailed description of: concept, use, and environments etc.

Our problem is market research and getting this in front of the right people, correctly.  We know the market it will work in and can use a couple of software products (that this item will most likely work in conjunction with) to formulate similar sales numbers since this item will be HIGHLY sought after once produced. 

We don't know how or what to do next.  We do not want to let this out in an unprotected way.

My brother is creator and owner of the patent, I am the sibling with marketing, advertising, web experience that has some business experience and thought he could help.

I am assuming that honesty is the best policy here.  We need help.  We don't have much time left.   If any of you have any help you could give or run a business taking things like this and selling them on a commission basis, we have a great product for a niche market that is very expansive. 

I welcome any feedback and will contact any reputable and viable solutions at my earliest availability.


Thanks for reading,
Robert

[MYK]

There is no such thing as a "provisional patent".  What you most likely are talking about is a provisional application for a patent.

How is it that he could file an application for a patent when the invention still "need[ s ] much development and research"?  It doesn't seem possible to have filed a meaningful application if this is the case, although stranger things have happened.

You also mention that it "is something NOT currently in use in the field it is designed for."  Is it something that already is in use in some other field?

As far as the substance of your question, I would suggest (1) getting your application reviewed by a USPTO-registered patent agent or attorney (be certain the person is registered), (2) making sure that the application provides some sort of meaningful protection of the invention, (3) using the provisional as the basis for filing a nonprovisional application, (4) putting together a strong pitch, and (5) contacting companies in the field of the invention directly (i.e., if you've come up with a better can opener, go talk with Zyliss;  if you've figured out a better car navigation system, go talk with Garmin or Nokia).

The USPTO has a portal for independent inventors, to try to educate the public about the system and some of the traps that you face.  I would suggest reading through some of it:
http://www.uspto.gov/inventors/independent/index.jsp

Also, here's the page for the complaints about "invention submission companies":
http://www.uspto.gov/inventors/scam_prevention/complaints/index.jsp
I would suggest reading through a few of these to understand why you need to be extremely careful if you attempt to use an "invention submission company".  There are a very few legitimate firms that try to help inventors develop and/or market products;  they seem to be more the exception than the rule.

[bleedingpen]

I am trying to help my brother sell his provisional patent or "idea" to the right development company.  Product is technology based and will need much development and research.  Once designed and implemented, it will have a world-wide market and is something NOT currently in use in the field it is designed for.

We are almost completely lost on the appropriate next step.  We have:   Provisional Patent,  Working name and logo, rudimentary schematics, a single elegant render, descriptive scenario explaining the concept, conceptual images of product in use, as well as: detailed description of: concept, use, and environments etc.

Our problem is market research and getting this in front of the right people, correctly.  We know the market it will work in and can use a couple of software products (that this item will most likely work in conjunction with) to formulate similar sales numbers since this item will be HIGHLY sought after once produced. 

We don't know how or what to do next.  We do not want to let this out in an unprotected way.

My brother is creator and owner of the patent, I am the sibling with marketing, advertising, web experience that has some business experience and thought he could help.

I am assuming that honesty is the best policy here.  We need help.  We don't have much time left.   If any of you have any help you could give or run a business taking things like this and selling them on a commission basis, we have a great product for a niche market that is very expansive. 

I welcome any feedback and will contact any reputable and viable solutions at my earliest availability.


Thanks for reading,
Robert

It appears as though you don't have enough money to file the utility conversion, is that correct?

If that is the case, you have a very steep uphill battle ahead of you, particularly since you don't have any IP rights at this point. 

Furthermore, if time is an issue, you have to consider that most interested companies aren't going to just simply write you a check without performing their own due diligence on the IP protections available and relevant market size.  That takes time that you don't apparently have. 

So, what I am getting at is that you probably need to file the utility conversion and then work on the marketing aspect.  You might find a patent attorney that will help you out as far as pointing you in the right direction for market research and presentation if you file the utility patent application with that attorney.  And I understand that funding is an issue, so you are probably at that proverbial "rock and a hard place."

Best of luck.

[Primogen]

looks like we have many things to still iron out.   I appreciate the time, effort, and advice.  As far as know, he has employed an attorney to get him this far.  If he only has this provisional application, he may have been taken on a wild goose chase or simply did not get the correct advice/instruction to move forward.  I am/was completely in the dark about any of this and it is a real eye opener. 

Thank you both very much for your help

[Primogen]

NEW INFORMATION:   I just spoke with my brother and he told me the application has already been submitted and we have Patent Pending status on our project.  Are we now at the point of having something to move forward with?   He does have a pat. attorney involved with the project and yes $$ is huge issue (usually is, right?).

I am currently formulating some questions for the attorney to explain some of the terms used in this thread so far since all of it might as well be mandarin Chinese to me.

[bleedingpen]

Are we now at the point of having something to move forward with?

Depends entirely on facts that we don't appear to have. 

Earlier you mentioned that time was of the essence- that makes me think that you filed a provisional and you are creeping up on the 1 year utility conversion date.  You need to figure out whether that is the case as it will change what you do from here.

[Primogen]

Are we now at the point of having something to move forward with?

Depends entirely on facts that we don't appear to have. 

Earlier you mentioned that time was of the essence- that makes me think that you filed a provisional and you are creeping up on the 1 year utility conversion date.  You need to figure out whether that is the case as it will change what you do from here.

^^^this is exactly the situation.   


I will gladly answer any questions any of you may have that will help formulate a basis for discussion, I simply don't know what information is pertinent/extraneous. 

[doug vagedes]

I am trying to help my brother sell his provisional patent or "idea" to the right development company.  Product is technology based and will need much development and research.

One problem I see is that trying to market this to a potential investor, you say "this idea will need much development and research."  It sounds like you don't have much to offer an investor other than an idea on a napkin, so they will have to spend the additional time, energy and capital to hopefully bring it to market.  And the problem with provisional applications is that things change with R&D and therefore will most likely cause problems for your provisional.

If as bleedingpen guessed, that your 1 year clock is soon to stop, you will probably lose your negotiating leverage and should take whatever deal you can hope for or file.  Keep in mind that while you think your baby is the most beautiful ever, many others won't, and that your idea may or may not have the world-wide appeal you think.  Maybe a focus group can confirm that and hopefully improve your negotiating power. 
   

[George White]

This is definitely not legal advice. One poor option you might add to your list of poor options is to re-file the content of the provisional application as a regular non-provisional utility application before the year is up. To get a date it will need at least an omnibus claim and drawings and something written that refers to the drawings.

It will likely be a very badly written utility application that you will never take through the system. But, when you do have more money and time a CIP can be filed against the utility application you file now. The org. utility would then be abandoned. It is a way to extend the benefit (to the extent there is any) of the provisional application past the year for the cost of a filing fee. If, as a thought experiment, this seems like a horrible idea, it is because you are thinking the provisional application is probably full of holes.

--George

[dtpater]

Patents are valuable, but firstly you need proof of concept that it works (most of the time or I have done it twice without prototype and only 3D CAD and animation getting deals based on this only)

Market and Patent research also for past products that did not have Patents is also a very good idea.

Inventors should see more value in the trade Secret option (NDA's and a good document trail), until they are ready to Patent:

To many Inventors race out and apply for patents when they are not ready, to early and kill their chances of success later down the track due to a poorly researched and applied new Patent.

Its rare for a Patent attorney to say to the Inventor you are not ready yet, come back 3 months when you have done all these things first?, what if Patent attorneys challenged Inventors more to get it all together first, its not in the Patent attorneys financial interest so it does not happen but it should?

I really believe there needs to be a criteria set, before Inventors can lodge patents, like a check list and the Inventor signs off on it.

This does not mean they cannot lodge on the day, it just gives them something to consider, because it is a critical part of any new project, I kept this below Invention a trade secret for 12 years and the manufacture paid for the Patents and tooling!

I will have 20 Patents worldwide that manufactures pay for, that is for 4 new products, and yes I get upfront payments and royalties

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7739806.pdf

Help from a Good Friend Below!

“This the right time and the most important time for the Inventor and the Patent attorney to sit down and organize the Patents to be applied and the reason why half of Asian Manufactures prefer a clean skin Invention (That’s with no Patents), this gives them control on how the Patents are written and applied..’

Very good, Derek.
There is a clear difference between a patent written around an invention, and one written around a developed designed , market-ready ,invention based product.
Something about it giving companies a more focused defense strategy.
You can see the sense of a ‘clean skin’ policy, offering designed, invention-based products, using NDA’s ,and then the patent being written around the finished commercial product, enabling companies to effectively plan around the patent.
Patenting then is at its most effective, and written within the context of market realities and optimum defense.
It makes compelling sense.


 

[Primogen]

I came back after a couple days and found some very help stuff in here, thank you.   I have a ton of questions to ask his attorney now, regarding some of this information.  I will report back here when i have further news and questions for you guys out there.   


the feedback and help in here is tremendous.   Much respect for your time and effort in helping us.

[dtpater]

Good Luck!

personally I am investing in domains as below to protect branding for my new products some info below.

"Adjustment and applying trademarks"

Also this new .CO is a smart brand protection method      http://www.cointernet.co/

www.stairsquare.com 
www.stairsquare.co

www.roofingprotractor.com
www.roofingprotractor.co

below are providers which have good pricing and service is also good.

http://www.namecheap.com/

and this one below I just found yesterday is the cheapest for .CO  that I have found so far.

http://www.uniteddomains.com/

[how to patent]

I just wanted to say a few things about the effort of "trying to sell the provisional patent". I've written an article about this and giving advice on how to patent, but I'll give you the gist of things. Basically, I've gone through the process myself and can tell you with certainty that the chances of selling a FULL PATENT are almost non-existant (0.002% of patents actually make more money in licencing than was spent on the patenting fees - Davison.com).

You're far better off doing the commercialisation yourselves, or getting an engineering firm to do the product development for you. Companies don't want to test new ideas - they let you do that. Then, if a product is, indeed, successful then you have a case on you to licence your invention.

[dtpater]

Those Davison Figures are for themselves only, this web link below is more realistic and comments from people over a period of time!

http://www.inventionstatistics.com/Innovation_Risk_Taking_Inventors.html

yes its very tough in this game, but from my research and experience 2% of all patents making it into the market place is more realistic and well gives Inventors a more positive mindset then at least, even if its closer to 1%

Yes product development is the key working with www.jamb.com.au for me personally, having both the 3D CAD Tooling files and instructions and 3D Computer Video's

and if you have an outstanding new product you do not need any proven sales, just the design and marketing support.

As we all know there are many different ways to do this new product stuff!, do what work's for you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JcjAIqCD9M
 

[dtpater]

"Companies don't want to test new ideas - they let you do that. Then, if a product is, indeed, successful then you have a case on you to licence your invention"

The above is only part true, Taiwan Manufactures are very keen for new products, to claw back their market share against China and also Taiwan make better new products and have a better understanding of Western Business and have been doing this longer and do not always have the OEM Manufacture mentality, because they are very much integrated in the U.S schooling for example and better company registration etc..

Like sending You-Tube files and other links is easy for Taiwan, so for me it all lean's that way focusing on value added quality new product's, that are still price point competitive.

If you have the old school mentality for business, well that's were you will be stuck, example below done without patents or prototypes, all done with 3D cad Files and assignment from the Canadian Inventor, we already have interest for U.S Distribution and Europe.

http://www.taiwanlevel.com/902-all.htm