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Author Topic: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION  (Read 2942 times)

eeengineer

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I OWN A SMALL BUSINESS, HAVE DEGREES IN ENGINEERING AND PHYSICS, AND HAVE BEEN ISSUED ABOUT 16 PATENTS OF WHICH 10 I HAVE FILED AND PROSECUTED MYSELF.  IN OTHER WORDS, I AM TECHNICALLY QUALIFIED AND HAVE SIGNIFICANT EXPERIENCE WORKING WITH PATENT LAW AND THE PATENT OFFICE.  I HAVE A CLOSE BUSINESS RELATIONSHIP WITH ANOTHER COMPANY, AND THE OWNER OF THIS OTHER COMPANY, WHO ALSO IS A FRIEND, WANTS TO HIRE ME TO DO AT LEAST SOME OF THE PATENT WORK ON AN INVENTION OF HIS.  I AM NOT REGISTERED WITH THE USPTO, AND MY QUESTION IS HOW MUCH WORK CAN I DO FOR HIM LEGALLY.  CAN I JUST HELP HIM UNDER CONTRACT BUT LET HIM ACTUALLY DO THE FILING, OR IF HE PAYS ME AS AN EMPLOYEE, DOES THAT GIVE ME ESSENTIALLY FREE REIN TO HELP HIM, THERE AGAIN HE WOULD HAVE TO ACTUALLY DO THE FILING.
ANY INFORMATION ON THIS IS APPRECIATED; I DON'T WANT TO DO ANYTHING UNLAWFUL BUT WOULD LIKE TO HELP MY BUSINESS ASSOCIATE AND FRIEND.
 
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blakesq

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #1 on: 05-16-10 at 01:47 pm »

What you propose is the unauthorized practice of law, and you may liable for criminal sanctions.



I OWN A SMALL BUSINESS, HAVE DEGREES IN ENGINEERING AND PHYSICS, AND HAVE BEEN ISSUED ABOUT 16 PATENTS OF WHICH 10 I HAVE FILED AND PROSECUTED MYSELF.  IN OTHER WORDS, I AM TECHNICALLY QUALIFIED AND HAVE SIGNIFICANT EXPERIENCE WORKING WITH PATENT LAW AND THE PATENT OFFICE.  I HAVE A CLOSE BUSINESS RELATIONSHIP WITH ANOTHER COMPANY, AND THE OWNER OF THIS OTHER COMPANY, WHO ALSO IS A FRIEND, WANTS TO HIRE ME TO DO AT LEAST SOME OF THE PATENT WORK ON AN INVENTION OF HIS.  I AM NOT REGISTERED WITH THE USPTO, AND MY QUESTION IS HOW MUCH WORK CAN I DO FOR HIM LEGALLY.  CAN I JUST HELP HIM UNDER CONTRACT BUT LET HIM ACTUALLY DO THE FILING, OR IF HE PAYS ME AS AN EMPLOYEE, DOES THAT GIVE ME ESSENTIALLY FREE REIN TO HELP HIM, THERE AGAIN HE WOULD HAVE TO ACTUALLY DO THE FILING.
ANY INFORMATION ON THIS IS APPRECIATED; I DON'T WANT TO DO ANYTHING UNLAWFUL BUT WOULD LIKE TO HELP MY BUSINESS ASSOCIATE AND FRIEND.
 

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smgsmc

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #2 on: 05-16-10 at 02:17 pm »

What you propose is the unauthorized practice of law, and you may liable for criminal sanctions.

I had a related question a couple of years ago and didn't get a clear answer.  What if the friend, who is an inventor, does the actual filing pro se, and you are providing consultation?
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blakesq

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #3 on: 05-16-10 at 03:26 pm »

Unauthorized practice of law.  Just like if you helped your friend write his own will. 


What you propose is the unauthorized practice of law, and you may liable for criminal sanctions.

I had a related question a couple of years ago and didn't get a clear answer.  What if the friend, who is an inventor, does the actual filing pro se, and you are providing consultation?
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MYK

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #4 on: 05-16-10 at 04:04 pm »

What you propose is the unauthorized practice of law, and you may liable for criminal sanctions.
Where did he write that he was giving out legal advice?
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blakesq

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #5 on: 05-16-10 at 04:13 pm »

"WANTS TO HIRE ME TO DO AT LEAST SOME OF THE PATENT WORK ON AN INVENTION OF HIS"




What you propose is the unauthorized practice of law, and you may liable for criminal sanctions.
Where did he write that he was giving out legal advice?
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Kaitlin

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #6 on: 05-16-10 at 06:34 pm »

It may depend on your state, but this is definitely a dicey area.  True, patent agents are not lawyers yet are permitted to prepare patents.  And what you are proposing may not be more than what a patent agent would do.  But it is important to note that although they may be non-lawyers, patent agents are licensed by the federal government, which it appears you are not.  While I think I see where MYK's coming from*, I believe you would nevertheless be at risk for your local bar agreeing with blakesq's assessment of the situation. 

See, for example, Oregon State Bar v. Ortiz, 77 Ore. App. 532, 534 (1986).  In that case a non-attorney had a business helping people prepare immigration visa and citizenship applications.  The state bar issued an injunction against him.  He claimed that federal law permitted laypeople to help in certain circumstances and so had preempted the state law on the matter.  The Oregon Court of Appeals held that he was doing more than what was permitted by federal law and that therefore the state law controlled, concluding that he was engaged in the unauthorized practice of law (relying on the example of a NY patent practice case, in the process):

"The question is whether defendant is immune from state regulation, even though he does not fit within the federal exceptions to the attorney requirement. An almost identical question has arisen in patent law cases.  In People by Lefkowitz v. Lawrence Peska Associates, Inc., 90 Misc 2d 59, 393 NYS2d 650 (1977), the court held that, although New York state does not have jurisdiction to regulate patent attorneys or patent agents who are registered with the Patent Office, the state can control the unlawful practice of law by nonregistered practitioners. The court noted that certain lay people are permitted to prepare patent applications, even though that might constitute the unauthorized practice of law, solely because they have federal authority to do so; however, when they lack that authority, the state can regulate their unauthorized practice. 90 Misc 2d at 62. In In Re Amalgamated Development Co., Inc., 375 A2d 494 (DC Ct App), cert den 434 U.S. 924 (1977), the court, after discussing the federal regulations allowing the lay practice of patent law, stated: "[ I ]f the federal government  has not granted a license in this area, a state is free to enforce its own licensing regulations." 375 A2d at 497. (Emphasis in original [omitted].) By analogy, because defendant is not authorized by federal law to practice in immigration proceedings, he is subject to state regulation."

And note that attorneys also can run afoul of the law by engaging in "the unauthorized practice of law" if advising in areas in which we're not licensed.  Cf. the DC case of In Re Amalgamated Development Co., Inc.:
"An attorney who helps an inventor prepare the inventor’s own application has engaged in the unauthorized practice of law even though the attorney discloses to the inventor that he is not registered to practice before the Patent Office and does not personally file anything with the Patent Office." In Re Amalgamated Development Co., 375 A.2d 494, 189 U.S.P.Q. 192 (D.C. Cir. 1977).


*It seems logical to conclude that since patent agents aren't lawyers yet are permitted to prosecute patents, that patent prosecution doesn't constitute the practice of law.  (That was my first reaction.)  But that doesn't seem to be how it is treated by the courts.  Rather, it seems that the patent prosecutor's role falls within a sub-specialty of law, and that that sub-specialty has a peculiar exemption for those lay people who have proven their expertise within the sub-specialty.  So in this view the advising which is part of patent prosecution would constitute the practice of law, but licensed patent agents would be seen to have special permission to advise within that limited area.
« Last Edit: 05-17-10 at 05:49 am by Kaitlin »
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Wiscagent

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #7 on: 05-17-10 at 04:41 am »

Doesn't UPL typically involve misrepresentation?  Certainly a casual conversation where a non-attorney acquaintance provides some advice on a legal matter (such as how to avoid taxes, get out of a speeding ticket, or how to sue a merchant) is not prosecuted by the state as being UPL. 

In the original poster's (OP) scenario there is no deception.  The client fully understands that the OP is not a patent practitioner.  Doesn't that mitigate against UPL?  Also, would an explicit disclaimer by the OP help?  Something to the effect that:

 "I am not an attorney, a patent attorney, or a patent practitioner, and I do not represent you before the patent office.  Any advice I provide relative to this patent application is my personal opinion, based on my experience and technical expertise, not based on any formal legal training.   I recommend that you consult with a patent practitioner before filing this patent application."
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Kaitlin

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #8 on: 05-17-10 at 06:05 am »

...and you may liable for criminal sanctions.
It would surprise me to find criminal sanctions where the person isn't pretending to be an attorney.  Anyone know of jurisdictions where criminal sanctions might be imposed in the absence of fraud?

(See e.g., the 2004 LA County DA's UNAUTHORIZED PRACTICE OF LAW MANUAL FOR PROSECUTORS.)

Edit---
Also, would an explicit disclaimer by the OP help?  Something to the effect that:

 "I am not an attorney, a patent attorney, or a patent practitioner, and I do not represent you before the patent office.  Any advice I provide relative to this patent application is my personal opinion, based on my experience and technical expertise, not based on any formal legal training.   I recommend that you consult with a patent practitioner before filing this patent application."

Would such a disclaimer help in avoiding any criminal sanctions based on fraud?  One would presume the answer to be "yes."  But I doubt the disclaimer would work as a defense against civil or equitable remedies.  If there were a contract dispute between the person helping and the person being helped I could see a court putting on its equity hat to refuse to enforce payment.
« Last Edit: 05-17-10 at 06:18 am by Kaitlin »
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DogDayPM 9er9er9er

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #9 on: 05-17-10 at 06:46 am »

The OP is proposing to charge fees for doing patent application preparation.  Why isn't that an unauthorized presumption of a patent agent's license?
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eeengineer

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #10 on: 05-17-10 at 06:52 am »

I DO APPRECIATE ALL THE REPLIES TO MY ORIGINAL QUESTION AS TO MY HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION.  ONE AREA THAT WAS NOT ADDRESSED HOWEVER IS MY ASSOCIATE, BEING IN BUSINESS, COULD ACTUALLY HIRE ME AS AN EMPLOYEE TO DO THIS WORK (DO THE 941'S, W2'S, ETC).  IT SEEMS THAT IF I AM HIS EMPLOYEE, WE IN ESSENCE AS FAR AS THE LAW IS CONCERNED ARE THE SAME PERSON.  FOR INSTANCE, AS I SAID EARLIER, I FILE MY OWN APPLICATIONS AND DEAL WITH THE PATENT OFFICE; WHY COULDN'T I HIRE SOMEONE (WHO IS NOT A PATENT AGENT BUT MAYBE WORKED FOR A PATENT LAW FIRM AND HAS SOME EXPERTISE IN THE FIELD)  TO FILE APPLICATIONS FOR ME.  I WOULD STILL NEED TO SIGN ALL THE DOCUMENTS MYSELF AND MAKE THE ACTUAL APPLICATION MYSELF, BUT ACTUALLY FILE MATERIAL WHICH THIS EMPLOYEE HELPED ME DRAFT.  
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bleedingpen

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #11 on: 05-17-10 at 07:38 am »

Seems like the easiest thing may be for the OP to pass the patent bar and become an agent.
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bacon

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #12 on: 05-17-10 at 07:53 am »

I DO APPRECIATE ALL THE REPLIES TO MY ORIGINAL QUESTION AS TO MY HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION.  ONE AREA THAT WAS NOT ADDRESSED HOWEVER IS MY ASSOCIATE, BEING IN BUSINESS, COULD ACTUALLY HIRE ME AS AN EMPLOYEE TO DO THIS WORK (DO THE 941'S, W2'S, ETC).  IT SEEMS THAT IF I AM HIS EMPLOYEE, WE IN ESSENCE AS FAR AS THE LAW IS CONCERNED ARE THE SAME PERSON.  FOR INSTANCE, AS I SAID EARLIER, I FILE MY OWN APPLICATIONS AND DEAL WITH THE PATENT OFFICE; WHY COULDN'T I HIRE SOMEONE (WHO IS NOT A PATENT AGENT BUT MAYBE WORKED FOR A PATENT LAW FIRM AND HAS SOME EXPERTISE IN THE FIELD)  TO FILE APPLICATIONS FOR ME.  I WOULD STILL NEED TO SIGN ALL THE DOCUMENTS MYSELF AND MAKE THE ACTUAL APPLICATION MYSELF, BUT ACTUALLY FILE MATERIAL WHICH THIS EMPLOYEE HELPED ME DRAFT.  

You personally are an inventor.  Your business is an assignee (assuming you assigned your rights to your business).  You are confusing inventor (who may prosecute his own application before the USPTO) with an assignee (who does not have that right).  It does not matter who signs the documents, preparing the documents is practicing before the USPTO.
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blakesq

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #13 on: 05-17-10 at 07:55 am »

What is the different between what you propose, and somebody who owns a business, hiring some bum off the street, and having the bum prepare a will for that somebody?  It would still be UPL. 


I DO APPRECIATE ALL THE REPLIES TO MY ORIGINAL QUESTION AS TO MY HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION.  ONE AREA THAT WAS NOT ADDRESSED HOWEVER IS MY ASSOCIATE, BEING IN BUSINESS, COULD ACTUALLY HIRE ME AS AN EMPLOYEE TO DO THIS WORK (DO THE 941'S, W2'S, ETC).  IT SEEMS THAT IF I AM HIS EMPLOYEE, WE IN ESSENCE AS FAR AS THE LAW IS CONCERNED ARE THE SAME PERSON.  FOR INSTANCE, AS I SAID EARLIER, I FILE MY OWN APPLICATIONS AND DEAL WITH THE PATENT OFFICE; WHY COULDN'T I HIRE SOMEONE (WHO IS NOT A PATENT AGENT BUT MAYBE WORKED FOR A PATENT LAW FIRM AND HAS SOME EXPERTISE IN THE FIELD)  TO FILE APPLICATIONS FOR ME.  I WOULD STILL NEED TO SIGN ALL THE DOCUMENTS MYSELF AND MAKE THE ACTUAL APPLICATION MYSELF, BUT ACTUALLY FILE MATERIAL WHICH THIS EMPLOYEE HELPED ME DRAFT.  
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Wiscagent

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Re: HELPING A BUSINESS ASSOCIATE WITH A PATENT APPLICATION
« Reply #14 on: 05-17-10 at 08:16 am »

You personally are an inventor.  Your business is an assignee (assuming you assigned your rights to your business).  You are confusing inventor (who may prosecute his own application before the USPTO) with an assignee (who does not have that right).  It does not matter who signs the documents, preparing the documents is practicing before the USPTO.

Under § 3.71 the assignee, or presumably an authorized employee of the assignee, may prosecute their own patent application.  As I understand that rule the right to prosecute the application is irrespective of whether or not the employee is a patent practitioner.  Also, presumably if the employee has the right to prosecute the application, the employee also has the right to draft the application.
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§ 3.71 Prosecution by assignee.
(a) Patents - conducting of prosecution. One or more assignees as defined in paragraph (b) of this section may, after becoming of record pursuant to paragraph (c) of this section, conduct prosecution of a national patent application or a reexamination proceeding to the exclusion of either the inventive entity, or the assignee(s) previously entitled to conduct prosecution.
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