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   How far can infringment go?
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   Author  Topic: How far can infringment go?  (Read 2118 times)
rougie
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How far can infringment go?
« on: Nov 14th, 2007, 6:30pm »
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Hello,
 
Hello folks!
 
 
I want to get one thing straight, basically, how are we supposed to detect infringement in electronic circuits?
 
Hence, here is a hypothetical example, suppose that one of my claims in my patent says the following,  
 
"I have a circuit that is made up of 2 - 4 bit shift registers which store 8 bits (1 Byte) of data and the last bit denotes if this byte should be destroyed or not (a destroyer bit)"
 
Lets say a big company does the same thing but using 1 shift register instead of 2 - 4 bit shift registers to store the 8 bits (1 byte) of data without any destroyer bit. Can the the big company claim that I am infringing on the idea. Look, the idea is similar, but not identical. Also, say that my idea appears to  
be an improvement over the competitors idea. So this should be recognized by the judge!!!! And how would this really be recognized, who will actually point out these miticulous differences, the patent lawyer's litigators ... I think not!  
The big company's patents.... I think not!!!!  
 
I mean words can be put together with many meanings. Take my shift register example, In a patent I can word it in atleats 5 different ways and each way could precicely describe  
my example or each way can also *vaguely* describe my example.
 
For example, if the big company's patent says, "we have a shift register that can store 8 bits(1 byte) with a mechanism that can denote if the byte should  
be destroyed or not."
 
When compared to my statement, this can be argued to kingdom come! They both mean the same but are not identical in their methodology.... Now, who the hell is going to drill down into the actual interpretations of such scenarios.  
 
A judge would not even know where to start, the patent lawyer's litigators only go with words within the patent, and words can be tricky as I just demonstrated. And another thing about patent lawyers, they really don't understand what they are actually writting when it comes to doing an electronics patent... I know, as my patent lawyer one day asked me, "Robert, what do you mean when you say the term HEX!" My mouth dropped!!!!!!!!!!
 
So it leaves one last option and that is to get experts in the field for both sides. And still this could be arguable between the experts. For example my destroyer bit, can be a mechinasm too, no!
 
The IP infrastructure is simply not well designed if you want my opinion. It leaves too many loop holes for big companies and opurtunists to steal creativity.  
 
I don't know what the solution to this would be... but if there isn't any, then why the hell do we inventors bother inventing stuff. Its fine when you as an inventor have a pation for a scientific field, however, the legal system should  
recognize that you deserve protection.
 
Another question is, what if my core circuit does not infringe on any of their cicuits but I have other circuits that do,what happens then.
 
All feedback appreciated!
 
With regards
Roberto
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DJoshEsq
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Re: How far can infringment go?
« Reply #1 on: Dec 2nd, 2007, 1:29am »
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Experts will be presented in nearly every patent infringement case.  It appears to me that you do not have a full understanding of the U.S. patent system.  
 
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D. Joshua Smith, Esq.
Registered Patent Attorney
McDonald Hopkins, LLC
Cleveland, OH
216-348-5400
bcapehart
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Re: How far can infringment go?
« Reply #2 on: Dec 2nd, 2007, 2:10pm »
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Roberto - Looks like you don't have a lot of trust in the patent system.  Unfortunately, this is the field we play in.  If you truly want to seek answers to your questions, you should probably seek answers from a patent litigation attorney.  There are many such attorneys with EE backgrounds.
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Brent A. Capehart
Patents, Trademarks, Copyrights
Deep in the Ozark Mountains
bcapehart@ozarklawyer.com
yahsureyoubetcha
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Re: How far can infringment go?
« Reply #3 on: Dec 2nd, 2007, 3:42pm »
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Well, that's why you draft the application to discuss obvious variations, and why you draft the claims broadly, and why the Doctrine of Equivalents is so much fun.
 
If all you've got is a "picture claim", somebody did something wrong.
 
Not understanding "hex", well, not every patent attorney is a SWE/CE/ECE/EE.  Then again, it might have been your fault for throwing the word out in a context that didn't make a lot of sense.  More information would be needed to say why he didn't understand what you meant.
 
And if your other circuits infringe, then they infringe.  License or cross-license, or come up with a workaround.  (Preferably a drastic improvement that can be patented!)
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rougie
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Re: How far can infringment go?
« Reply #4 on: Dec 6th, 2007, 10:05pm »
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Helo, and thanks for all your posts!
 
>Experts will be presented in nearly every patent infringement >case.  It appears to me that you do not have a full >understanding of the U.S. patent system.  
 
Gee DJoshEsq, I can't really hide anything from you!!!!!
Of course I don't have a full understanding of the U.S. patent system.  I am not a lawyer which means unlike you, I am not in my comfort zone. This is why people like me come to this site... to get informed about patent law. I don't intend to become a lawyer either, so don't ask me to do my homework and read tons of documents on the Internet or the USPTO. I am a high tech inventor, got probably 1000 times more technical information in my mind then most people!    
 
On the second note, then if experts will be presented in nearly every patent infringement, then why would I need a litigation  lawyer? Me and my expert could probably point out all the necessary points in order to rectify all infrigment issues in most effecient time frame.
 
> Looks like you don't have a lot of trust in the patent system.?
No, I don't, because, it costs lots of money to educate lawyers, judges and juries about my circuits and their possible infringements. And If the bigger company has more money, then they win by default.
 
>Unfortunately, this is the field we play in.  If you truly want to >seek answers to your questions, you should probably seek >answers from a patent litigation attorney.  There are many >such attorneys with EE backgrounds.  
I have an attorney, thats how I got my patent done, $12000.00 later! I find its really not worthed.
 
Excuse me! the term "hex" was very, very relevant to the communications protocol claim! What's a:SWE/CE/ECE/EEHuh
My patent lawyer is a phd!
 
Question, is the shape and the modular concept of a product patentable?
 
Sorry for being so challenging guys, but I just don't believe in spending 1/2 million dollars for an infringment issue of my circuits when this would be able to be decifered between experts in 5 minutes.
 
I guess why I am scared is when I hear of the RIM horrorifying  case of going to 600 million dollars, like what the hell where they looking at, I mean  yahsureyoubetcha said himself:
"And if your other circuits infringe, then they infringe"
 
Confused?
 
Robert
 
 
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